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Hello my name is Lukas 'jackis' Knotek

first i will briefly introduce myself. Im ex cod2 player. I started at cod1 as a kid but mostly I used to play play cod2 and been at the very top at around 2010-2012 and some casual cod4 then i retired a then came back mainly cause of bat44 as I have nothing else competetive to play on :)

I take myself as a very analytical person and many of these ideas are based on hundreds of hours of observing. Ive also been having closer look into battalion since its kickstarter and backed through humble bundle. Talked to devs at FSL cod2 lan in Germany and gladly and thanksfuly they took some advices probably from many of us to their hearts. So here are some ideas that came across my mind lately.

 

  1. Springfield noscope bolt - One of a few very frustrating things for me as a rifle man was not having a one shot kill rifle at american side besides scope which was restricted for one per team. There were mods where this feature was added at it was really cool. Having rifles on both sides would be really great and with some limited economy version that has been slightly mentioned also playable. Casual people would enjoy it mostlikely aswel.
  2. Rifle zoom sightsSo far from what i have seen there has been done amazing work with kar98k. So far we haven't seen lee-enfiled gun but in cod2 when u zoomed there has been very annoying moment when u couldn't seen an enemy cause of the iron on top of the gun. The enemey at certain point could hide behidn that iron aspecially at a long range distances. Better shown at the picture. Having those irons tighters would make the gun more friendly to use. From the battalion footage of kar98k its been done very well.
  3. Non-regenerative HealthFrom what I have experienced it is very annoying when I perhaps tag a guy with rifle 3 times in one round (The same guy) and then he gives me one bullet HS with m1. This happened many times and adding that non-regenerative feature would completely make the game more strategic, competetive and much more interesting. I see this working very well in csgo and I have experienced regenerative mode in cod2-cod4 and I can clearly say non-regenerative is way to go. Hopefully more people will reconsider this. But Im worried devs are already cleared on this one.
  4. Wallshots - I found this very important and probably has been discussed couple times? Im not sure feel free to correct me. But I really hated the way cod4 was and I know i'm not alone in this one. Where u could shoot through pretty much anything (Please don't get triggered). At the same time the lack of shoot through in cod2 was a extreme too. I see many places in a map like woods, closed windows (as cod2 dawnville - B houses) etc. which u can shoot through that would make it more interesting. But these has to be placed at a certain tactical areas of the map but definetly not typical brick walls. In cod2 it was quite good but the clip abuse was too damn high. Without clip in battalion (Either lean or prone clip) there will be no such problem. Maybe only corners of the building. Yea that seems like a way to go. 
  5. Nade kills - This really depends whether non-regenerative health is being applied or not. But I remember rounds where we could've killed 4 out of 5 people by nades and they had just such a high impact on the game. Nerfing them down a bit would help the match by a lot. Im not sure how devs are about adding flashes and molotovs into the game but it seems like a good idea.
  6. Spectator mode - Now I find this truly important for this to be a spectator esport however I believe the devs probably already has a plan. Im just gonna think out something that bothers me with the shoutcasting at csgo perhaps. I'd really welcome something like a split screen where u can see at the same time both sights of players. It's like when u have 1v1 u wanna see that action from both of players perspective right? Or maybe like having a four small boxes on the right side of the screen with others players perspective. Or just random cameras at certain positions of the map that can be switched. Cause when they spectate csgo they truly jump from one players to another and another so many times it sometimes get shaky and many times they miss the action. The idea of this whole suggestion is to not miss the action. U wanna see it happening while it is happening. Not just see the scoreboards and looking at the replay ;) 
  7. Moviemaking friendly - I imagine there will be tons of fragmovies comming out from this game as it used to back in the day from cod and i wasnt some good moviemaker myself but i was able to put something solid atleast together but I remember it used to be pretty hard to make something. You had to write down some scripts in excel just to make 360 around a player view and free move throughout the map was nearly impossible. Im not saying u couldnt do those but it would be nice to have these featuers already in the game just like pressing up button for xxx and stuff. Just a reminder on a thing to not miss ;)) 

 

Lastly it took me some time to write this so be nice on me and please use constructive critisicm if need be. I ususally get some ideas when I watch soemthing and then forget them :D These ones are the one that just got into my mind lately and I finally ve finally found the effort to write it. 

Ok one last thing :D I backed the game through humble bundle and ive noticed some people has it shown in their profile view here on forum but I don't any help with that? Thanks guys.

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1 - The idea I think is that the M1 garand is a decent substitute to the Kar98k nonscoped, 2 shots were needed to kill unless you hit the arm or down part of the leg both times. The M1 was fast to fire and fast to reload, plus it helped with the dynamic of the american play-style. 

2- That was not the big of a problem in competitive matches, and you had the M1 Garand as a possible choice.

3- Debatable... I think regenerative health adds a different concept, it takes the "luck factor" down. The reason is if someone surprises you but you managed to escape that means that the other player didn't have the skill to do the job, or your movement ability was on point. Random nades, smoke shots and other things that are not skill inclined get nullified with regenerative health, unless of course the "lucky shot/nade" was deadly and that's is impossible to stop. Plus, it reinforces skill, since almost all battles will equal.

4- Wallshots should be featured I think, but it must be done very carefully since small and fast maps would be very affected by this.

5- I believe the nades on COD2 were perfect, both in damage area and distance. This made the game extremely strategic, you could sweep entire areas if synchronized nades of all teammates, and the same could be done to you once you secured the location you intended to take. Players needed to be cautious all the time and keep one eye in the sky. Maps like burgundy, toujane and dawnville were very affected by nades, but maps like Caen, matmata not so much.

6- I believe the same concept of CSGO would be fine.

7- Yes, please.

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Regenerative health is an absolute must for this game. 

The implications for not having this features are a lot more than you realize i think. I check the forums now and then in hopes that everything on track but i really only need to respond when people suggest regenerative health shouldn't be in the game. It absolutely should, its vital. 

 

Non-regenerative Health From what I have experienced it is very annoying when I perhaps tag a guy with rifle 3 times in one round (The same guy) and then he gives me one bullet HS with m1. This happened many times and adding that non-regenerative feature would completely make the game more strategic, competetive and much more interesting. I see this working very well in csgo and I have experienced regenerative mode in cod2-cod4 and I can clearly say non-regenerative is way to go. Hopefully more people will reconsider this. But Im worried devs are already cleared on this one.

 

Hopefully rifle tags are consistent and that it's 1 hit above the belt. The lack of regenerative health. i argue makes the game less strategic and less dynamic. Since grouping up is better and all pushing to one site becomes the norm. In cod you have diverse roll out strats for attack and defence since 1 player theoretically could kill all the people at one site and open it up. In CSGO it's a lot harder to accomplish that since your first fire fight you're tagged and now you have to wait for your team mates before you have a good shot at killing the other people. The strategy is different sure but it vastly changes the style of the game. 

The second thing is that it's more balanced this way. Each contact you have is on equal footing. You go into each individual fire fight on a even footing. This is important for things like clutching. Additionally if it becomes an E-Sport it makes it much more exciting to watch. CSGO yes you can clutch but its a lot tougher and happens more rarely. due to non regenerative health. An individual player can have more impact this way instead of getting worn down by 5 other players constantly tagging him. i was global in CS , not that it means much and played every invite season of cod4 competitive in Australia. Jumping into a game against a far worse team i could effect the game far more as an individual in cod than i could in cs and this is all down to regen. 

Deciding between regen and no regen isn't a small change to the game , its probably one of the biggest. Its drastically will change how the game is played at the top level and pretty much any competition level at the very least. 

 

 

 

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On 9/3/2017 at 7:37 PM, jackis said:

Wallshots - I found this very important and probably has been discussed couple times? Im not sure feel free to correct me. But I really hated the way cod4 was and I know i'm not alone in this one. Where u could shoot through pretty much anything (Please don't get triggered). At the same time the lack of shoot through in cod2 was a extreme too. I see many places in a map like woods, closed windows (as cod2 dawnville - B houses) etc. which u can shoot through that would make it more interesting. But these has to be placed at a certain tactical areas of the map but definetly not typical brick walls. In cod2 it was quite good but the clip abuse was too damn high. Without clip in battalion (Either lean or prone clip) there will be no such problem. Maybe only corners of the building. Yea that seems like a way to go. 

This has been discussed already and the thing where they probably will go for is wallbanging the same way as it is in CS:GO atm.
Able to penetrate light surfaces such as wood, and trough corners/edges of concrete walls.  People won't be able to shoot trough a brick wall as far as I heard :) 

On 9/3/2017 at 7:37 PM, jackis said:

Ok one last thing :D I backed the game through humble bundle and ive noticed some people has it shown in their profile view here on forum but I don't any help with that? Thanks guys.

About this you should contact @[CM] BigTuna, send him a pm with what you bought and what email you used. He can look it up and give you the rank.

 

Nice post bro, glad to see people putting out their ideas. I also hope for a nice spectator mode. If PUBG was able to pull off a good spectator mode i'm pretty sure Battalion will get this sorted as well :) And about the non-regen health, I completely agree. It does'nt really make sense when you hit someone (about 85 damage) with a kar, and he can just walk off with it after hiding for a few seconds. However I think this is part of their plan I think. @RevoluT. has a good point on that one. Taking the luck factor down. This way people can not just spray, throw nades and get a kill without having any skill or even seeing the enemy :) (except when you're standing on top of a nade ofcourse...)

 

Nice ideas! Let's see what the rest of the community thinks of this!

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On 9/3/2017 at 6:37 PM, jackis said:

perhaps tag a guy with rifle 3 times in one round (The same guy) and then he gives me one bullet HS with m1

then hes better than you cause he managed to headshot you with his first bullet after you failed to kill him with three 

On 9/10/2017 at 7:05 AM, muso said:

The lack of regenerative health. i argue makes the game less strategic and less dynamic

 

it would also make the game slow/boring as fuck tbh

Edited by ono
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None regenerative health means that you don't really need to think about attacking someone because any damage is permanent damage, with regenerative health you need to make sure that you down the guy you take a shot at, which makes it arguably more strategic. Also every fight is 100hp vs 100hp, making it more likely that the better player wins. I don't think encouraging spam and chip damage makes for compelling gameplay. And what stops the m1 player from one tapping you without regenerative health, he only needs one shot after all.

31 minutes ago, ono said:

it would also make the game slow/boring as fuck tbh

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Thanks guys for your opinions.

I really just wanted to start a discussion here and see different views. 

Some reactions: 

Revolut: 1)+2) - I know what m1 was used for. I just suggested it would be a good addition to put that springfield without scope there as an other alternative. And yes actually lee-enfiled zoom has been quite a big issue in competetive matches. Many people rather used m1 then lee and this was one big aspect of it. No need to change my opinion on this I know this 100% Ive spent so many years there on top of competetive cod2 matches.. 

                     6) - Yes it is good as it is. I was just thinking about adding a new feature? Having done whats out there and adding something new isn't a bad idea don't you think? Like I said seeing that 1v1 from both perspective would be really interesting. While watching only one of them you have 50% chance that you will see the guy that gets the kill. Seeing both at the same time gives you 100% ;)

Dark: Thanks for your appreciation. Its good to see someone who just doesnt slam things down on the internet :)

Ono: Or maybe he was just a noob with a bunch of luck ;)

 

Regenerative health: Thank you all for your wide explanation on this aspecially muso. I did kinda see it the way you are explaining it aswel but maybe not as widely. Maybe a time-lenght of that regen should be longer then it used to be in cod2. Maybe like 20 sec would it. In cod4 you could just shoot through a wall but in cod2 aspecially in cod2 with no wallbang it was srsly painful when you tagged someone he just hided away behind the object and after like 5-7 sec he was alright and ready to shoot again.. Maybe this longer regen would be better solution? 

 

Saying there is less clutches in csgo is absolutely right however its not cause of non-regen but because of economy and people saving up weapons. I think Joe mentioned that there will be some certain economy in bat44 where you are handed certain amount of "cards" - weapons for each half/round and even if you die you still get a "card" - weapon next round. So there would be absolutely no problem of people pushing that 1v3 situation with non-regen. Still think it would be more strategic this way. You would have to think twice where you go or what you do. Players would have to be more careful and cooperate more. But now I see that maybe longer regen time is the thing we need. Just don't do it cod2 way please.

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1 hour ago, jackis said:

 

Revolut: 1)+2) - I know what m1 was used for. I just suggested it would be a good addition to put that springfield without scope there as an other alternative. And yes actually lee-enfiled zoom has been quite a big issue in competetive matches. Many people rather used m1 then lee and this was one big aspect of it. No need to change my opinion on this I know this 100% Ive spent so many years there on top of competetive cod2 matches.. 

                     6) - Yes it is good as it is. I was just thinking about adding a new feature? Having done whats out there and adding something new isn't a bad idea don't you think? Like I said seeing that 1v1 from both perspective would be really interesting. While watching only one of them you have 50% chance that you will see the guy that gets the kill. Seeing both at the same time gives you 100% ;)

Regenerative health: Thank you all for your wide explanation on this aspecially muso. I did kinda see it the way you are explaining it aswel but maybe not as widely. Maybe a time-lenght of that regen should be longer then it used to be in cod2. Maybe like 20 sec would it. In cod4 you could just shoot through a wall but in cod2 aspecially in cod2 with no wallbang it was srsly painful when you tagged someone he just hided away behind the object and after like 5-7 sec he was alright and ready to shoot again.. Maybe this longer regen would be better solution? 

Saying there is less clutches in csgo is absolutely right however its not cause of non-regen but because of economy and people saving up weapons. I think Joe mentioned that there will be some certain economy in bat44 where you are handed certain amount of "cards" - weapons for each half/round and even if you die you still get a "card" - weapon next round. So there would be absolutely no problem of people pushing that 1v3 situation with non-regen. Still think it would be more strategic this way. You would have to think twice where you go or what you do. Players would have to be more careful and cooperate more. But now I see that maybe longer regen time is the thing we need. Just don't do it cod2 way please.

First, I'm sorry if I sounded aggressive in my first post, It was not my intention. 

Its cool to have discussions, its never too much to reinforce what you already know, after all, there are tons of variables and sometimes we may forget even things we already know.

Regarding 1-2: I believe the use of the M1 was not because the Lee was bad due to lack of visibility, but because the M1 was goddamn strong, 90% of the time 2 hits would kill and you had 8, with very good precision and fairly easy to control recoil. If we consider 0% a noob and a 100% a GOD player, I would argue that a 50-75% player would benefit more from a M1 than from a action bolt, since they were more forgiving. Plus, in a map like Carentan I doubt players would take a Springfield rifle over an M1 due to a lot of close quarters action.
I feel like bolt actions should be more encouraged for the defensive team, and semis/autos for the attacking team.

Regarding 6: It could be tested, but I find it very difficult to work, I think 2 screens at the same time will have people confused.

Regenerative health: Maybe increasing the time to recover could be a good idea, it depends a lot from map design, if the game happens to have most of its competitive plays in big maps, more time to recover doesn't make much sense, it would slow the game down too much, however, if most games happens in small maps it could be a good idea.

I believe that the COD2 time to regenerate gave the game a more "frenetic" style, and to be honest I enjoy it. But I think once the game is out, this would be easy to test with updates.

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I would like to react only to health regeneration. 

And since I did already talk about that on Alpha section, but it didn't include anything under NDA, let me quote myself here:

Quote

Well lets put it this way. When you have a static health system, then you depend on how much HP you have at the moment. It actually limits your options and won't allow you to play to your full potential. 1v5 situations with no regen is close to impossible while 1v5 with regen is manageable.

I just don't see a reason why you should be penalized for being an active player and trying to make some plays. There should be no advantage whatsoever. Everyone should be equal to each other and only skill + teamwork should matter. Nothing more. If you are someone who can deal with the whole enemy team one by one, then you should be able to do that and the game should not stop you from doing so. 

Someone might come and say "but CS has a static health system and you can win 1v5". But who says, its a perfect system? And why should we try to copy anything related with CS, we should go the other route and try to be as different as possible if this game should have a chance on a competitive scene. This game has a different tempo. And that changes whole gameplay. Regen is something that makes this tempo possible. If they removed any of that, it would become a completely different game. Also regen always worked great on CoD4 competitive scene and I don't think that there were many people complaining. 

Quote

Some people argue that regen promotes camping more than static health. Well, tell me, what seems more like a camping? Going back for a several seconds every time you are low on hp or playing passive for the rest of the game once you are low on hp? 

As for skill / competitive aspect. What could possibly be more skill dependent than for players to be equal to each other? Let's say you scored a kill and you are left with 80hp. You are no longer equal to other enemy players with 100%. Sure, you still have a chance against them, you might still even kill all of them, but every single time you receive a hit, you are being less equal to everyone else. And my point is, why should a competitive game punish you for being a proactive player? What is the reason behind that? If anything, it should reward you and not doing the opposite. Being able to regen after each fight and having an equal chance in the next one seems like the most skill oriented feature to me. 

Also you care way more if you get a hit in a game with static health than in a game with regen. That's why regen itself promotes proactive play. Something that is interesting to watch for spectators. And the gameplay is also more dynamic and action based. 

 

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On 9/12/2017 at 1:34 AM, jackis said:

 

 

Regenerative health: Thank you all for your wide explanation on this aspecially muso. I did kinda see it the way you are explaining it aswel but maybe not as widely. Maybe a time-lenght of that regen should be longer then it used to be in cod2. Maybe like 20 sec would it. In cod4 you could just shoot through a wall but in cod2 aspecially in cod2 with no wallbang it was srsly painful when you tagged someone he just hided away behind the object and after like 5-7 sec he was alright and ready to shoot again.. Maybe this longer regen would be better solution? 

 

 

Thats completely fair and a good point. Is there plans for bullet penetration? 

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On 19. 9. 2017 at 2:33 PM, muso said:

Thats completely fair and a good point. Is there plans for bullet penetration? 

Yeah you actually proved me wrong on that non-regen health but now I believe that longer regen is the way to go. Setting a proper time will need a lot of testing but 15-20 sec seems about right to finish that 1v1 fight even if a tagged guy hides behind a vehicle.

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