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hedarn    18

I really love the idea behind the modding community etc. but seeing that people are waiting for this game just because of modding tools is crazy. People didn't even play the close alpha version and some want already mod the game for more realistic feeling. 

 

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Edited by hedarn
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jeffu    17

It's much harder to get a competitive game made properly than to make a casual game. A casual gamer can play a competitive game casually. A competitive gamer cannot play a casual game competitively. I'm happy that Bulkhead seem to actually understand this and are prioritizing things like movement - something casuals probably won't even notice or care too much about if it's good or bad. If you want a realism mod to be created, why isn't your community modding something like Day of Infamy, Red Orchestra, or Squad? Those games seem to be closer in gameplay to the style you want to play. Why force a competitive focused game like Battalion 1944 into something it's not?

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Switz    47
On 4/22/2017 at 3:07 PM, hedarn said:

I really love the idea behind the modding community etc. but seeing that people are waiting for this game just because of modding tools is crazy. People didn't even play the close alpha version and some want already mod the game for more realistic feeling. 

Not intentionally bringing it up again, but for those here who where hoping to have a play style like shown in the KS video then yes, we are now here for the future mod tools instead of the actual game.  It is not a very crazy concept.  

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Trashy    0

The original KS concept and video is what made me want to back this project. Tbh, I wasn't that impressed with the latest trailer but I understand it is still very early.

I was pretty hype over a year ago but coming back and seeing the new direction I'm not sure how I feel. I guess we'll see eventually. I am, however, excited to come back to the forums and see the upvote/downvote system! So that's a plus...

Just wake me up for the closed beta.

 

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Sergionator    2
On 28/4/2017 at 8:30 PM, Trashy said:

The original KS concept and video is what made me want to back this project. Tbh, I wasn't that impressed with the latest trailer but I understand it is still very early.

I was pretty hype over a year ago but coming back and seeing the new direction I'm not sure how I feel. I guess we'll see eventually. I am, however, excited to come back to the forums and see the upvote/downvote system! So that's a plus...

Just wake me up for the closed beta.

 

This. I didn't see this kind of "fast" gameplay when I saw the Kickstarter vídeo that made me support the project. I was expecting something like Day of Defeat or COD2 in terms of "game speed", not like Quake or Unreal Tournament. I dont know, maybe it feels different when you play it yourself, we'll have to wait.

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RAFF    105
39 minutes ago, Sergionator said:

This. I didn't see this kind of "fast" gameplay when I saw the Kickstarter vídeo that made me support the project. I was expecting something like Day of Defeat or COD2 in terms of "game speed", not like Quake or Unreal Tournament. I dont know, maybe it feels different when you play it yourself, we'll have to wait.

Have you ever played Quake or Unreal Tournament?

The 'game speed' is way closer to cod2 than those two games.

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Sergionator    2
2 hours ago, RAFF said:

Have you ever played Quake or Unreal Tournament?

The 'game speed' is way closer to cod2 than those two games.

I did, and I don't remember those strafe jumps on COD2. But as I said, maybe it feels different playing it by yourself. Less than 1 month to go.

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pukiz    34
11 minutes ago, Sergionator said:

I did, and I don't remember those strafe jumps on COD2. But as I said, maybe it feels different playing it by yourself. Less than 1 month to go.

They were in COD2 it just didn't have sprint. COD4 is a closer comparison

 

 

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Wabbit    15

This thread has honestly been an entertaining read but being someone that lurks and doesn't get too involved I am going to say a few things:

 

People who are loud, will always continue to be loud and share their opinion regardless if they have, or not, put effort into researching information that is already available to them. It's also good to look at the big picture and to look clearly what has already been stated officially and what information is missing. Don't paint your own picture what the outcome of the project is going to be, take in what information is available to you and keep it in mind.

 

Look at the big picture, this is going to be a competitive game in development, very much like the old games cod 2, MoH and possibly cod4. For a lot of projects, development goals can change, however we have known before this gameplay footage was released that many of the members of bulkhead have played fps games competitively and also got involved in modding which is one of the key things of how they got recognised and joined Bulkhead. You can use this information to figure out that this game will probably be focused towards a competitive playstyle and may have modding support, however modding is down the longer road and is not confirmed. So don't go ahead claiming to the public community that things will be added to the game that hasn't been announced or confirmed by Bulkhead officially. It's a project in the making guys and you also got to keep in mind that any design decision can be changed on a whim.

 

That's the sort of thing you as a kickstarter backer needs to consider before pledging to a project in development. Don't be angry at someone else you threw money at for not making the game the way you thought it was going to be, reconsider what you are about to post publicly towards a gaming community and consider if it's actually useful to you and others. Be calm in your responses, collect all the information that is available and seek understanding on reason. Being angry is pointless and all it does is make yourself look like a buffoon.

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moose456    3
On 4/22/2017 at 6:01 PM, jeffu said:

It's much harder to get a competitive game made properly than to make a casual game. A casual gamer can play a competitive game casually. A competitive gamer cannot play a casual game competitively. I'm happy that Bulkhead seem to actually understand this and are prioritizing things like movement - something casuals probably won't even notice or care too much about if it's good or bad. If you want a realism mod to be created, why isn't your community modding something like Day of Infamy, Red Orchestra, or Squad? Those games seem to be closer in gameplay to the style you want to play. Why force a competitive focused game like Battalion 1944 into something it's not?

Not that I don't agree with what was said in this post. But can someone define for me what the difference is between a Casual, Competitive, and a Realism player. Because I feel like we throw out these terms like we have defined classes of people playing but i don't think we know exactly what they are. 

What am I getting at: I believe that a game built for realism will be able to handle both competitive and casual players. Satisfying most if not all players in the long run, the slower pace of the game helps you not top out on excitement which leads to burn out. Which is why a lot of people stop playing a lot of these games all together these days due to too much quick fun for prolonged periods of time which leads to burnout. Then your on to the next.  

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pukiz    34
3 hours ago, moose456 said:

Not that I don't agree with what was said in this post. But can someone define for me what the difference is between a Casual, Competitive, and a Realism player. Because I feel like we throw out these terms like we have defined classes of people playing but i don't think we know exactly what they are. 

What am I getting at: I believe that a game built for realism will be able to handle both competitive and casual players. Satisfying most if not all players in the long run, the slower pace of the game helps you not top out on excitement which leads to burn out. Which is why a lot of people stop playing a lot of these games all together these days due to too much quick fun for prolonged periods of time which leads to burnout. Then your on to the next.  

Please give an example of a single realistic competitive game, just the one example will do

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Masser    55
On 2017-4-22 at 4:30 PM, Switz said:

But by "modding it in", that means we are without for the next TWO YEARS.  

 

Just saying.  And that is on the graces of a nice individual with the know how to mod the core game files to add it when in all honesty, just how much time would it take the Devs who know their code inside and out to add it in themselves?  The next "argument" will be that "they need every player playing the core game method because COMP is the #1 thing to get right".   Funny, because if any casual person ever recommends anything given that thinking then it will be shot down and it is also not like comp players wont be nit picking and playing on default mode constantly to provide plenty of feedback making that argument pretty worthless.  Face it, some of you have some sort of agenda to not want realism folk and causal players here.  

Same story I have seen in a dozen shooters where the casual fan base is attempted to be shut down.  

 

Got a few points. First of all, coding knowledge is not uncommon. I know that coding isn't a universal thing that everyone knows, but I personally have been surprised by the people I found who I knew how to code. A friend of mind presented to me a program made in Java, when I never even knew he could code. Over the last two years, I have seen that happen 9-10 times. It isn't unlikely for someone who either is a realism player themselves to know how to create a theatre file or edit the server variables to fine tune it, or someone who wants to help the realism crowd to do it for them as a good person.

Also, why for the next two years? I know a friend who learnt to make theatre files, compile them, bug fix and with a bit of balance logic now has the most popular third party 5v5 theatre for Insurgency in two months. Admittedly the scene is small, but the fact he now knows how to make the game altering file and is technically proficient in making them, shows it isn't impossible.

Secondly, the developers are able to add in server side variables which would be able to change the game itself. I don't think I need to add much more context to explain that.

Thirdly, this game is catering to the Call of Duty 2 and 4 players, competitive or not. There were a lot of casual players, but the game play style is what the developers are after. It's not supposed to be realistic. It is similar to playing Squad in 16v16 or whatever it is, and saying that the developers don't balance the game around the weapons, spawns ect. Squad is supposed to be a semi-realistic, immersive, slow and tactical squad based shooter where you work together, of course the game isn't just going to buff the AK in the same way 5v5 FPS would that is based around the balance and raw reflexes some people have. I wouldn't expect that from Squad to a certain extent. Two completely different experiences.

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Switz    47

You have to consider what needs coding in order to make a realism server in a game like BATT44 which can be said about every old school shooter types.  Coming from DODS, every realism server operator had their fair share of grey hairs setting servers up and lurking sourcemod forums for new mods and active download links that would break servers with compatibility issues and many hours of trial and error to get right.  Plus we never saw some mods we where hoping would get developed because no one simply knew how to make them.  DODS had a major nodding section so that leaves me with a lot of skepticism that all that should be in a realism server can in fact be added by as you say, the average coder who are plentiful. 

 

Can they set up areas of the map attackers cannot cross or defenders leave?

What about weapon drops and jams?

Can they change the health system to add a medic?

 

Just three of 100 changes that would be required and yes, all of which can be added, but by who?  I have a post somewhere (on phone so I can't link) that details all the "requirements" and ganemodes we (the Days of War Realism Community) presented to the DOW Devs for the realism config that they will be adding.  I think I posted it somewhere in the suggestions area IDK as a reply to a existing thread talking about game modes or mods.  Anyway, that goes over all the changes that would need to occur which are pretty much the same as BATT44 except ADS mode firing mechanics.  If some stranger who knows some code can pull that off???.....no way IMO.  

So honestly, what is the harm with encouraging Bulkhead to do the same as DOW and cater to their future realism community which will 100% be here as they are in every COD game.  And just like DOW, we are not asking that they change the actual game, just make us a separate config once all is done.  

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pukiz    34
1 hour ago, Switz said:

You have to consider what needs coding in order to make a realism server in a game like BATT44 which can be said about every old school shooter types.  Coming from DODS, every realism server operator had their fair share of grey hairs setting servers up and lurking sourcemod forums for new mods and active download links that would break servers with compatibility issues and many hours of trial and error to get right.  Plus we never saw some mods we where hoping would get developed because no one simply knew how to make them.  DODS had a major nodding section so that leaves me with a lot of skepticism that all that should be in a realism server can in fact be added by as you say, the average coder who are plentiful. 

 

Can they set up areas of the map attackers cannot cross or defenders leave?

What about weapon drops and jams?

Can they change the health system to add a medic?

 

Just three of 100 changes that would be required and yes, all of which can be added, but by who?  I have a post somewhere (on phone so I can't link) that details all the "requirements" and ganemodes we (the Days of War Realism Community) presented to the DOW Devs for the realism config that they will be adding.  I think I posted it somewhere in the suggestions area IDK as a reply to a existing thread talking about game modes or mods.  Anyway, that goes over all the changes that would need to occur which are pretty much the same as BATT44 except ADS mode firing mechanics.  If some stranger who knows some code can pull that off???.....no way IMO.  

So honestly, what is the harm with encouraging Bulkhead to do the same as DOW and cater to their future realism community which will 100% be here as they are in every COD game.  And just like DOW, we are not asking that they change the actual game, just make us a separate config once all is done.  

I can't stress enough how much time and effort goes into doing a software release, especially in a small team. Chances are they will simply not have the resources to create a separate mod for the small part of the community that wants realism considering the fact that it's nowhere near their selling point and there's other games out there which cater to this specific crowd

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jeffu    17

You are asking to change the game, though. Setting up special zones? Weapon drops and jamming? Medic class? These are all things that aren't in the game and will take development time from Bulkhead for a very small group that isn't their target audience.

 

I honestly don't expect the DoW devs to give you what you're looking for either. Their dev team is smaller than Bulkhead and they still have a long ways to go in making the base game playable and good. If you needed 100 mods to make DoDS "realism mode", then why not start with a game that's closer to what you're looking for like ARMA, Day of Infamy, Squad, or Red Orchestra? Why do you keep trying to modify arcade shooters into something they're not meant to be? 

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Switz    47
8 hours ago, jeffu said:

You are asking to change the game, though. Setting up special zones? Weapon drops and jamming? Medic class? These are all things that aren't in the game and will take development time from Bulkhead for a very small group that isn't their target audience.

 

I honestly don't expect the DoW devs to give you what you're looking for either. Their dev team is smaller than Bulkhead and they still have a long ways to go in making the base game playable and good. If you needed 100 mods to make DoDS "realism mode", then why not start with a game that's closer to what you're looking for like ARMA, Day of Infamy, Squad, or Red Orchestra? Why do you keep trying to modify arcade shooters into something they're not meant to be? 

Wrong, asking for a separate config.  Not for them to change the base/default game.  Just like being able to choose between Search and Destroy servers and Team Deathmatch, I would like to see Realism added.  

 

We (Realism players) are here for the same reasons you are.  Was their a "Squad" back in the late 90's and early 00's?  You do realize it is for nostalgia reasons us wanting to have a realism mod server in a classic fast paced game right or does your general disdain for the realism community blind you from seeing that?

Their target audience is people waning the classic feeling we all had.  We (Realism players) are ALSO that audience whether you like it or not.  

 

If you want competitive...go play CSGO.  See how stupid that sounds?  You are here for the same reasons I am, we just prefer different modes.  Only difference I am seeing is, I have no expectations of seeing my mode for years to come and do not expect it (if the devs do decide to work on it) to come until the very end so all of you can have your precious 5vs5 settings.  

And for clarifications, the DOW devs have been up from about the realism config from the very beginning with myself and other leaders of the community who have put together sources from WRM, DODS Realism and MOH.  It was confirmed in pre-alpha, mid-alpha and EA that it is still the plan to add it at the end.  They are the ones who asked for us to put together a list of all the options we would like added.  Not something we did on our own.  And yes, some of them are aware and even where fans of realism servers and mode in DODS.

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ZeakQ    8

It's like asking a football game to add racecars because people want to have cars in the game... It's just not gonna happen (unless someone makes a mod out of it)

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Switz    47
11 minutes ago, ZeakQ said:

It's like asking a football game to add racecars because people want to have cars in the game... It's just not gonna happen (unless someone makes a mod out of it)

Just because it was modded into the game in the past, does not mean it should always remain "mod it in" status.

I have seen custom maps go on to become stock maps

I have seen game modes created by modders end up in newer games as a default mode

I have seen ACE voice system get integrated and made into the default VOIP 

But as soon as you say "Realism mode" people lose their minds?!

 

Chill out, what is the big deal and trying to steam roll it if recommended?  

 

 

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Masser    55
9 hours ago, Switz said:

Wrong, asking for a separate config.  Not for them to change the base/default game.  Just like being able to choose between Search and Destroy servers and Team Deathmatch, I would like to see Realism added.  

 

We (Realism players) are here for the same reasons you are.  Was their a "Squad" back in the late 90's and early 00's?  You do realize it is for nostalgia reasons us wanting to have a realism mod server in a classic fast paced game right or does your general disdain for the realism community blind you from seeing that?

Their target audience is people waning the classic feeling we all had.  We (Realism players) are ALSO that audience whether you like it or not.  

Right, so the first thing I want to point out is that adding a jamming mechanic would require new animations, sounds, VO's potentially as well. A medic class would require a reworking of you dying, which requires the triggers on the engine side to be added as well as a system for reviving, healing through medic kits or bandages, all requiring code, infrastructure, animations, models and would NOT just be a configuration change when the game has none of these systems in place. If it was just a little server.cfg that had something like:

proximityvo_1

ui_0

with a lot more settings of course, but basically just a premade list of server variables to replace the original, that would be fine. But what you are asking would require development time. This game may be being developed during the same time as Days of War, but that doesn't mean they have the same goals. They want to put their work into making it competitive and fast paced. Sure, they could have that with a realism mode in, but it would take time, and for each hour a developer is working, they are being paid. Money is not something which grows on trees, and so they need this. 

One last point, is that before I ever found CS:GO or even realised it had LAN's, before I heard COD4 was as big as it was, or COD2 or COD1 for that matter, I played Project Reality, Arma: Operation Flashpoint or Cold War Assault, however you want to call it, Arma 2, Arma 3. I then found CSGO and Insurgency within a year of each other, shortly followed by COD 4 and later COD 2. So belittling us all and bundling us up in one generalisation is not appreciated. I understand that there are people here who don't like realistic games mechanically, but just generalising us all sort of hurts.

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DarkMortyr    83

As far as I know, Bulkhead never promised any realism mode. I might be wrong but never heard them to mention it. 

Now what I do know. Bulkhead is a small studio so they have to choose their preferences very carefully. Once you are making a competitive game with a goal to really achieve something on the competitive scene, you have to be constantly working on that even several years after release. Just look what games do we have on eSport scene right now. These games have nothing but core gameplay mode, some variations of that and if it allows - community mods. And most of these games are made by much bigger companies. Competitive scene is a hard and constant work, a lot of games tried and failed. 

Just look at LoL and how long it took them to create a new maps or modes. These modes hardly even touch core gameplay. And it's made by a huge company. I am rather not even talking about CS and what was changed after 20 years. 

Something like "realism" in a game like this feels more like a work for a community than a developers. It's a bonus for a small % of players that are interested in it. There is just no benefit for developers to invest their time and resources to create something their game was never really supposed to be and will enjoy only a small amount of their player base.

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pukiz    34
11 hours ago, Switz said:

Wrong, asking for a separate config.  Not for them to change the base/default game.  Just like being able to choose between Search and Destroy servers and Team Deathmatch, I would like to see Realism added.  

 

We (Realism players) are here for the same reasons you are.  Was their a "Squad" back in the late 90's and early 00's?  You do realize it is for nostalgia reasons us wanting to have a realism mod server in a classic fast paced game right or does your general disdain for the realism community blind you from seeing that?

Their target audience is people waning the classic feeling we all had.  We (Realism players) are ALSO that audience whether you like it or not.  

 

If you want competitive...go play CSGO.  See how stupid that sounds?  You are here for the same reasons I am, we just prefer different modes.  Only difference I am seeing is, I have no expectations of seeing my mode for years to come and do not expect it (if the devs do decide to work on it) to come until the very end so all of you can have your precious 5vs5 settings.  

And for clarifications, the DOW devs have been up from about the realism config from the very beginning with myself and other leaders of the community who have put together sources from WRM, DODS Realism and MOH.  It was confirmed in pre-alpha, mid-alpha and EA that it is still the plan to add it at the end.  They are the ones who asked for us to put together a list of all the options we would like added.  Not something we did on our own.  And yes, some of them are aware and even where fans of realism servers and mode in DODS.

They don't magically create a separate config file which just enables realism. They first have to develop the mode and integrate it into the game much like masser said. Not as easy as you seem to think it is.

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jeffu    17
Quote

Appearances

- Different skins to illustrate who is designated the realisms leader for each side (like Cpt. bars) and squad leaders.

- Ability to upload your own images to be used as a maps in game mini map. Allows units to draw up private battle plans for a match and assign small units different routes, position callouts, objective numbers and notes.

- "Match" Config option to disable viewing in spectator

- Remove Teammate icons over heads

- MG Suppression effect. Blurred/Frantic vision when being shot at.



Classes

- Medic Class instead of self healing. And/or a blend of the two in which a Medic can heal to 80 health and a player can only heal ones self partially.



Gameplay Shooting/Weapons

- ADS only way to fire. If hip shoot is allowed, is wildly inaccurate and very unreliable.

- No Crosshairs

- Nerfed grenades so they do not travel as far

- Ammo count not by rounds, but by magazines / If reloading half empty mag, you lose the rounds inside it

- Unable to fire weapons while on ladders

- Shorter hand grenade and rifle nade timers (2.5-3.5 seconds)

- Larger blast radius of grenades



Gameplay Movement

- No bunny hopping. Should have a time limit on when a jump can be performed and cannot fire in animation.

- Leaning Left/Right

- Holster/Sling weapons when going up ladders (with animation and climbing animation)

- Slower strafe speed

- Higher recoil while moving in ADS or hip fire



Gameplay Misc

- More Fall damage

- Lower footstep sounds

- No ability to stand on ledges, sign posts or other non-realistic areas

- Voice Proximity (can hear anyone chatting in team talk within a 10 foot radius)

https://forums.playdaysofwar.com/forum/content-creation/content-creation/18679-days-of-war-realism-mode

 

Is this the list you were referring to? This is just a ridiculous amount of changes that would be needed to make the game into "realism mode". Even the reception on the DoW forums seem pretty lukewarm at best.

 

We all played the older games competitively and they did not require this many changes to core gameplay. DoD and DoD:S competitive were played with the stock game that did not require any mods. The "nostalgic" oldschool gameplay you are referring to is something that was created with 100 changes (your words) to a game that Bulkhead is not inspired by at all. None of these changes are as simple as setting some values in a config. I'd honestly be extremely surprised if this mode makes it into Days of War unless they completely abandon their current vision of the game and switch completely to realism mode. As mentioned earlier and by numerous people, this all requires developer, artist, and animator time to get these things looking right.

 

Battalion 1944 is advertised as CoD4 ProMod movement in a WW2 setting. Most of these changes would go directly against that idea and Bulkhead's vision of the game. I think they could add some maps or gamemodes that are close to what you are looking for (objective based) but they will never add gun jamming, less strafe speed, different recoil, suppression effects, medic classes etc. etc. just for 1 small niche gamemode.

 

Can you please answer why no one is modding Day of Infamy or any of the other more realistic games (ARMA WW2 mod sounds like it could be popular?) to suit your community's needs? Why are you trying to start with a base game that requires so many changes for your community to enjoy it?

 

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Switz    47
58 minutes ago, pukiz said:

They don't magically create a separate config file which just enables realism. They first have to develop the mode and integrate it into the game much like masser said. Not as easy as you seem to think it is.

Weren't you just saying any modder could just simply make it yesterday?  

 

All of this is nothing new.  In every game the comp community attempts to shit on the realism community.  Drive us off, force us to make ours own stuff, cry like babies when we don't accept some dumb tournament invite, add our suggestions....how hard is it to just let us have our own thing?  All you guys are doing is just arguing.  I have yet to see a dev hear say their official stance.  Until then, you are just showing me and the rest of the community what we can expect to see on how the realism community can be expected to be treated.  This all started when someone asked why we where even talking about mods.  

 

And it is a obvious answer,  we played these classic games and the MODS we fell in love with back in the day as well and want to add them again.  So since these mods where just as much as the old games as the default game play was back then, why not see if they have any plans on adding more of these classic mods that so many of us grew up playing and over time became the preferred method to play.  

 

I'm done posting here.  Way too many fanboys on this thread.  

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Masser    55
2 hours ago, Switz said:

Weren't you just saying any modder could just simply make it yesterday?  

 

All of this is nothing new.  In every game the comp community attempts to shit on the realism community.  Drive us off, force us to make ours own stuff, cry like babies when we don't accept some dumb tournament invite, add our suggestions....how hard is it to just let us have our own thing?  All you guys are doing is just arguing.  I have yet to see a dev hear say their official stance.  Until then, you are just showing me and the rest of the community what we can expect to see on how the realism community can be expected to be treated.  This all started when someone asked why we where even talking about mods.  

 

And it is a obvious answer,  we played these classic games and the MODS we fell in love with back in the day as well and want to add them again.  So since these mods where just as much as the old games as the default game play was back then, why not see if they have any plans on adding more of these classic mods that so many of us grew up playing and over time became the preferred method to play.  

 

I'm done posting here.  Way too many fanboys on this thread.  

Ok, let me lay this out a bit clearer. A coder would be easy to get, as there are likely people who want a FPS with a WW2 skin that is realistic despite there being a several WW2 games that cater to this, but that would be easy to get. A coder would be able to likely do the C++ (I think that is what UE4 is ran on) and other backend stuff, and so in theory, the backend would be easy. A config is different to that. A config on the server end is a little file with lines of variables that can be turned on or off, and are usually forced on the client side. This makes it so you can change things from the server tickrate, the ability to use custom skins, if UI elements show up on screen for the client ect. It can change some gameplay aspects, but I am assuming it can't be too complex as most are going to be set via numbers. So 0 might be off, 1 would be another variable, 2 would be a third. Most server variables I have seen only have those three variables, rarely seen a 3 or a 4.

The third one where you have things that require animations, textures, voice overs and other time consuming things. This is what would be hard. You could likely get a mod working for a realism mode without the developers easily, just without the fancy things to dress it up. Even with the developers, it would still take time and money which they hardly have in spades.

TLTR; You could get a working server with the realism mod easily and potentially without much support from the developers, but you would not get too far, certainly quickly, without the developers in making things such as textures, meshes, animations, sounds ect.

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DarkMortyr    83
1 hour ago, Switz said:

All of this is nothing new.  In every game the comp community attempts to shit on the realism community.  Drive us off, force us to make ours own stuff, cry like babies when we don't accept some dumb tournament invite, add our suggestions....how hard is it to just let us have our own thing? 

I personally don't have a single issue with a realism games / modes. I just find kinda weird why would someone look for a realism in a game, that is supposed to be the opposite. There are different games for that and if anyone is looking for a "realism", they are perfect. 

1 hour ago, Switz said:

 All you guys are doing is just arguing.

Hmm, that also applies for you. And there is nothing wrong on that. We are having a conversation about a possible future. That's what forum is for. And while we provided you with arguments why Battalion might not have an official realism mode, I don't think I've "heard" you say why you want it so much in there and not somewhere else.

I mean, yeah:

1 hour ago, Switz said:

And it is a obvious answer,  we played these classic games and the MODS we fell in love with back in the day as well and want to add them again.

But shouldn't you be looking for a game that is aiming for that? 

Same as you want realism, someone else might come and want a large scale battles. Because why not? WW2 fights on a big maps, why wouldn't that be a fun right? Then there is the other guy, that might like some WW2 vehicles on these large scale maps, because why the hell not. At the kickstarter, the last possible goal was a single player campaign. And I don't know about you but I am sure a lot of people would love a good campaign from WW2 (myself included). I would also love some Co-op missions. I am not sure if there is any WW2 game with a co-op implemented and it is something a lot of players are looking for but it's missing in a lot of good games. 

There are just too many things that "could" be there and someone / some community would be interested in (not just your realism mode) but any developer studio has a limited resources. That's why when they want to satisfy them, they sometimes allow modding, so people can add "anything" into game they want. Something that developers just couldn't, because they have their own issues / priorities and might not have that many employees.

I also don't understand why you are not ok with someone from the community to create this realism mode and why it would have to be developers to create one. From my experience community is sometimes capable of creating superior modes compared to what's officially in the game.

2 hours ago, Switz said:

 So since these mods where just as much as the old games as the default game play was back then

That's true. But back in the day, how many of them were focusing on a  competitive scene? It might not look like, but competitive focus takes a lot of resources and needs to be done precisely. Because even a single mistake might break the whole balance / game mechanics. And while you might afford to do such a mistake in a casual game, it will kill any chance for a competitive. So when you have a casual game in mind (and yeah, it might "accidentally" become a competitive game later), you also have much more options in other features and stuff that you can add in the game. 

1 hour ago, Switz said:

I have yet to see a dev hear say their official stance.

Yeah, and I am really looking forward to it. I would actually love some very interesting game modes. No matter the game, I never play just a core game mode if there are some other interesting options. In CoD4 I loved zombie mode a lot! I spent so much time in there. And when I found paintball mode, I didn't know what to play first haha.

The thing is, modes are great as long as creation of them doesn't negatively impact the core game and it's future. 

1 hour ago, Switz said:

Until then, you are just showing me and the rest of the community what we can expect to see on how the realism community can be expected to be treated.  

I wouldn't say so. So far I don't think anybody attacked you, was offensive in any way or treated you badly. Just because someone disagreed with you doesn't mean that he is being rude. This is a forum, everyone can say their opinion and we are just having a conversation. So as long as you don't take it personally, there was no harm done.

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