Jump to content
DustMouret

Spectating Battalion 1944 for competitive play

Recommended Posts

So I come from CS:GO and the CS franchise in general (mostly CS:S and CS:GO). I have served as an analyst and commentator in CS:S and CS:GO for several years (most recently doing CS:GO events for ELEAGUE, DreamHack, Gfinity, ECS, etc.). With those things in mind, I obviously am big into spectating the game for live commentary as well as review in post-game situations (analysis, content, etc.). So with that said I wanted to pose some thoughts about spectating games in Battalion 1944. 

A lot of this is going to be copy pasting features we see in CS:GO. I feel Valve really nailed spectating for the most part, especially in live situations. Though I will say, many of these features are also found in other games as well, especially in recent times.  Without further ado, here are some features I think are important to a great spectator experience.

 

X-ray: Having X-ray for character models for spectators is one of the best things I have seen added to spectating FPS games in the last few years. A lot of games are strictly streamed with X-ray on all the time. It really helps quickly see how people are set up or movement on the map while still being able to view the game in a player’s first person perspective. I definitely feel this needs to be a part of this game. You can do Red for Axis and Blue for Allies or something. However, recently in CoD IW I saw the X-ray color be based on the team colors (so OpTic Gaming X-ray colors were green for example). So there are some options on exactly how to implement it, but I would love to see X-ray in the game as early as possible for spectating.

 

 Mini Map/Map Overview: It goes without saying having a mini map is a big part of FPS games. Usually this sits in the top left corner or something of your screen as a player to get information about the map. As a spectator it lets you see everything and everyone. It’s definitely a big part of spectating. This is probably too obvious to even add here. However, a big thing from CS:GO and other games is the ability to pull up a giant map overview AND to be able to draw on it with different colors and stuff. This is a great tool to talk tactics and point things out. I would definitely love to see that being a part of the game.

 

A great Spectator GUI: This includes score, team names (maybe logos and country flag), clock, round number, map number (if it’s a bo3 or something so you can quickly see who has the map lead). Also player bars on the sides of the screen (name, what gun they have out, what nades they have, health/armor, number of kills in the round, etc. ) Finally, being able to go through the players with the number keys is HUGE to help with observing. One team is 1-5, the other team is 6-0 (again just look at CS:GO).

 

Map Cameras: Outside of the ability to follow players in first person as well as free roam around the map, having set cameras across the map for third person shots would be great. The added ability for an observer to customize where these cameras are setup will also be great. It can allow you some nice shots between the action and such to add to production value.  

 

Instant Replay: This is a great production element. Many people use external means to do it, not sure if it is possible just to be an added element of the game itself.

 

Demo playback: This is one of the things CS:GO got wrong. Demo playback in CS:GO is complete ass. Third party providers like Statshelix crush the actual in game system. I hope that a solid demo playback on this game can be achieved. It is great to be able to watch matches back and pick them apart.

 

These are just some of the biggest elements I see and enjoy in other games. I feel they are important to have to make the viewing experience great. I imagine many of these ideas are already in the works but thought I would share them here anyhow.  If I have any more ideas I may add them to this thread at a later date.

Edited by DustMouret
  • Upvote 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, DustMouret said:

Mini Map/Map Overview: It goes without saying having a mini map is a big part of FPS games. Usually this sits in the top left corner or something of your screen as a player to get information about the map. As a spectator it lets you see everything and everyone. It’s definitely a big part of spectating. This is probably too obvious to even add here. However, a big thing from CS:GO and other games is the ability to pull up a giant map overview AND to be able to draw on it with different colors and stuff. This is a great tool to talk tactics and point things out. I would definitely love to see that being a part of the game.

Battalion won't have a minimap.. compass only.. Maybe for spectating they will add minimap..? I don't know..

The compass will (i think) still show the players on your own team, but won't show red dots from firing enemies ;) and no buildings or other stuff

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, WeAsOne said:

Battalion won't have a minimap.. compass only.. Maybe for spectating they will add minimap..? I don't know..

The compass will (i think) still show the players on your own team, but won't show red dots from firing enemies ;) and no buildings or other stuff

This confirmed? Where at if so....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was searching.. but i can't see it somewhere confirmed..

Maybe i'm not right.....?

 

If i find something i will post it here

 

EDIT : This is the only thing i can find:

saying this: We have pretty much decided there won't be a mini map mate. Just a compass. 

So no confirmation on what i said..

Edited by WeAsOne

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No minimap would be bad for competitive players honestly. But we'll have to see some alpha.

 

Back to topic:

I like this idea. Built in replay feature would be awesome honestly

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Back in the days we had no minimap and plenty competitive players...

(IMO the minimap ruins the game)

 

But the ideas here from DusT are great for spectating :)

Edited by WeAsOne

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, WeAsOne said:

Back in the days we had no minimap and plenty competitive players...

(IMO the minimap ruins the game)

 

But the ideas here from DusT are great for spectating :)

 

1 hour ago, WeAsOne said:

Battalion won't have a minimap.. compass only.. Maybe for spectating they will add minimap..? I don't know..

The compass will (i think) still show the players on your own team, but won't show red dots from firing enemies ;) and no buildings or other stuff

 

 

I think a mini map for both in game and spectating would be best for competitive. Obviously you shouldn't be able to see your enemies, but seeing your team and map is great. At the very least it is important for spectating. As a commentator being able to keep tabs on what is going on across the map while focusing on the player on screen is super important. 

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, maddog-b said:

won't people just set up a second screen and use it as a substitute wall hack?

I am talking about for competitive play like tournaments and such. Usually they are streamed on a delay. Also you can restrict who is allowed to spectate. 

 

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like all the ideas that @DustMouret mentioned. They are a must in my opinion if BAT44 would like to be a big competitive and esport title. 

Turning back to the minimap or compass question, for me the minimap is more useful (just because all today's titles use minimaps), but the compass looks much more competitive in my eyes, because you'll have to communicate with your team a lot more, because you can't identify them on the map, because there is no map. Think about a CS:GO commentator: If he/she says the XY player shot the YZ player in BANANA, everybody knows which map are they playing, and where did the action happen. I'm sure BAT44 will have these kind of names aswell made by the community, so a true BAT44 player will always know what are people talking about. For newbie players and viewers, all I can say is learn it. :) Somehow I prefer the compass a bit more, but we will see, the alpha test is not that far.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Alomvampir said:

I like all the ideas that @DustMouret mentioned. They are a must in my opinion if BAT44 would like to be a big competitive and esport title. 

Turning back to the minimap or compass question, for me the minimap is more useful (just because all today's titles use minimaps), but the compass looks much more competitive in my eyes, because you'll have to communicate with your team a lot more, because you can't identify them on the map, because there is no map. Think about a CS:GO commentator: If he/she says the XY player shot the YZ player in BANANA, everybody knows which map are they playing, and where did the action happen. I'm sure BAT44 will have these kind of names aswell made by the community, so a true BAT44 player will always know what are people talking about. For newbie players and viewers, all I can say is learn it. :) Somehow I prefer the compass a bit more, but we will see, the alpha test is not that far.

I don't think compass vs. minimap will change communication that much. Also even if it did require comms that is a bad thing. You already have so much to comm about and if you add ambiguity to it all that just causes the comms to become flooded. I just think a mini map is better, especially for spectating, but I'd rather it over a compass in game as well. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can agree up to a point. It can be flooded, but a good team is built around good communication (that's my opinion). I don't know. It would be OK with me if they would leave the minimap out but we will see what they're planning to do with it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Game is inspired the most by 3 games: CoD2, MoH:AA and CoD4 PROMOD.. the first 2 have compass and only the last has minimap ;) I vote for the real oldschool

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Really interesting post @DustMouret ! ;)

Minimap : As said, they won't implement it but they can change their mind and provide option to turn it on and off (default) on server side. This way everyone will be happy.

Demo playback : have been talked yet
Below Joe's answer :

Other threads about it (just to remind them to devs if they read this :P) :

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, DustMouret said:

I am talking about for competitive play like tournaments and such. Usually they are streamed on a delay. Also you can restrict who is allowed to spectate. 

 

 

I quite like the idea itself but think careful thought needs put into the mechanics, possibly be achieved by the stream being captured(buffered) in demo format and a separate playback engine, otherwise this would leave the game wide open to exploits, personally I feel no info about "enemy" players should be available to a client until they are in view.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Soldat Ryan said:

Minimap : As said, they won't implement it but they can change their mind and provide option to turn it on and off (default) on server side. This way everyone will be happy.

X2UFxZY.jpg

;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As much as the minimap is useful, so is having the extra competitive aspect of no minimap and just compass. When you know where your enemies are because they "pop up" on the minimap when they shoot, to me, gives away their position. For spectating purposes i agree there should be a minimap. Honestly the only servers that will allow spectators is where it is a tournament or straight competition with admins being spectators. Competitive servers shouldn't have a spectator option as far as the public goes. If someone wants to watch they can always live stream it through steam or twitch.

What about the people who's internet can't handle streaming? Record it and show it to your friends or go into public non-ranked servers.

I honestly believe in public ranked servers there shouldn't be ANY spectators other than server admin (of course) but that also causes issues of if the admin is specing for the other team. So i believe that ranked servers must have 0 spectators and the only thing admin can do during gameplay is change server settings for map rotation. The only way to edit the server settings is for the game to end and to close the server.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In cod4 you had a minimap but the "red-dot" fix was implemented so red dots wouldn't come up when an enemy shot. That's how it was in competitive for Aus.

I think a cs/cod hybrid would be best where there's no red dots and each area is 'named' as you walk into it. 

Edited by muso
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@DustMouret

You should be proud. From personal exerience whenever "CSGO" is part of your post its already over.

On a more serious note, obviously I completele agree.

To add something: spectator tools are a must have, however when the game lacks tactical depth, meta and skill not even the most amazing spectator tools will make it interesting enough.

  • Downvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×